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Paadava EN Paadalai? Why do film MDs sing?

Topic started by Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on Sat Apr 6 09:58:32 EST 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Film Directors don't Act. Film Singers rarely Compose. Film Actors seldom sing (in every film.)

Yet, Film MDs sing. What could be the motivation behind this phenomenon?

Setting our preferences aside, could we share our thoughts on this blurring of professional identities?

Admittedly, there are a few songs that turn out to be appropriate (random example: Chandrabose's "Yendi Muththamma," MSV's "Sambo Siva Sambo" SDB's "Wahan Kaun Hai Tera" RDB's "Mehbooba" IRs "Aathadi Paavadai Kaathada" ) - but are these passable tunes enough to qualify MDs as Singers? Or should we just consider them to be fleeting (and interesting) abberations?

Here are few hypotheticals:
1. It's their tune, so why shouldn't they?
2. They know their compositions like nobody else.
3. There is a famine of good, trained singers.
4. It is cost-effective.
5. They can get away with it, thanks to their status as "genius" MDs.
6. Their fan-following pressures them to do so.
7. They know Music, so they should know how to Sing.
8. All successful MDs are failed singers, and this is their way to exact revenge for all the rejection.

Let's be critical (without being crass) in this investigation. If you have specific examples of Singer MDs hits and misses - and have any "formal" insights into their (non)singing - it would be a great help if you can share it with us all.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Sat Apr 13 16:18:10 EDT 2002
  
  Hello Arun - Good to see you here again. And thanks for sharing your thoughts. The points you raise are significant, and if at all there is any ambiguity in the preamble to this the thread, the responsibility is entirely mine.
  
  Let's begin with your statement about the "hypotheticals being speculative." Indeed, how is one to read someone's "mind"? That would call for clairvoyance, and I don't believe I possess any such "extra sensitive perceptions." :-)
  But Hypotheticals/Hypothesis are essentially "conjectural" - otherwise, they wouldn't be termed as such. They suggest possibilities for investigation rather than the probability of conclusion. Hence, you right in terming them as "speculation" - only I would choose a word that also includes the opening for a "rational" reasoning - "supposition."
  
  The notion of "selectivity" is included in the random examples I have provided in the preamble - perhaps it is not as self-evident as I thought:
  "Admittedly, there are a few songs that turn out to be appropriate..." Hence, I am not evading the issue of "selectivity." That is why those songs, which I have randomly enlisted (and there may be others) come immediately to mind. When I think "Mehbooba, Mehbooba" I think RD Burman (the same works for the other songs by the listed MDs.)
  
  The second part of that sentence, I realise, has potential for being miscontrued: By use of the word "aberrations" I was meaning "atypical" (the songs, the tunes, and the fact that they were sung by MDs and not "Singers" - more on the last bit later.) I was not in any manner of form implying that the MDs got it wrong or they were "imperfect" or had used technology to blot out their vocal defficiencies. I was using the word to qualify the songs - not the MDs. I hope this helps clarify things (although, I can now see how the confusion may have come about to begin with.)
  
  Let's move on to the "blurring of professional identities." I'll try to address this by means of a lateral example. The Dentist and The General Physician. They both are qualified "medical" professionals. They both understand human physiology. They can both prescribe Tylenol for pain-relief. However, they fulfill different needs - One a generalist - who will direct you the dentist if gingivitis is the problem. But at the same time, you will not go to a dentist if you have hayfever or food poisoning. Yes, the are both "physicians" but their identities are distinct.
  So, what's common between a Music Director and a Singer? Music. They both understand it, they both know the terminology. But they both are not necessarily interchangeable. One deals with the whole composition - from the first bars of the tune - right down to conducting and mixing. The other just belts it out. Does it mean that the singer does not know much about composition or vice versa? Definitely not. However, their professional identities can be grafted under terms of "macro" (MD) "micro" (Singer). That's how they are kept distinct.
  Having said that, I should rush to add that I am not advocating that distinct lines be drawn and the possibility of "crossover" be precluded at all costs. I am only trying to delienate how either one is "perceived" in professional terms. Does that make sense?
  
  The final detail - the reiteration of Hari's point - which you second to be "vital."
  I am the first one to acknowledge and recognise the aresenal of "absolutes." I am all for multiplicity and professional "secularism" (just made that one up!!:-) But, I am also the one up ahead in that line for advocating the value of "standards." Are Absolutes or Total Absence our only options? My interest is evaluation (and while this may seem academic or elitist) I believe this is what helps us reach some sort of understanding of excellence, aids us in separating the grains from the stones. Let me try this example: There is what we term "Literature" and what we term "Pulp Fiction." They are both "Writing" - and they both have "literary" aspects. But what makes one Literature and the other Pulp? Is it the best-seller lists? Is it the media-hype and the good-looking flap-jacked photo of the author? Is it the background of the author?
  I personally see it to as an issue of informed judgement, raising the aesthetic bar a notch up from what has transpired in the past, and insight into the "human condition," that is distilled in a way that transcends both, life and time.
  Of course, this is an ideal, and I am not suggesting that everything measure up to this - or else. But a commitment, and that industry - to try to make it happen, is essential. The choice is Money or Memory. Fame or Finesse. To Perfect or Pander (" "They have fans who are willing to pay and hear them sing".)
  But, I am sure, that you will agree that for the listener (as opposed to "fan") to raise the music appreciation bar, and the singer to deliver, if not all, at least 80% percent of that transcendence, would be a good standard to aim for?
  
  Of course, everything is subjective in life. What isn't? But does subjectivity have to mean an open-season for mediocrity - all the time?
  Sometimes, I think that word is used in these fora to either avoid conflict or close the window as the boss turns the corner :-)
  
  Have a wonderful Tamizh New Year's Day!
  
  (my apologies for any typos, inadvertent omissions etc.)
  
  
  
• From: arun_uk (@ 213.121.212.121) on: Sat Apr 13 17:17:04 EDT 2002
  
  Naaz
  
  Thank you.Happy Tamizh New Years day to you and to all DFers.
  
  I've read through your response a couple of times & acknowledge the points you have made. Thanks a lot.
  
  
• From: hari (@ 128.83.175.136) on: Sat Apr 13 18:08:08 EDT 2002
  
  Of course, everything is subjective in life. What isn't? But does subjectivity have to mean an open-season for mediocrity - all the time?
  
  So you are saying IR/ARR's voice is mediocre. The basic problem lies there. I say : For the song: engE sellum indha pAdhai from sEthu, SPB or anyone else's voice would have sounded mediocre and inappropriate according to me.
  
  Next you would say -- but i already said admittedly there are a few songs which are appropriate. To that I say,list the songs that seem inappropriate to you.. and to that you could say... certainly it is "unacceptable" to listen to nAn thEdum sevvandhippoovidhu in IR's mediocre voice when SPB could have done wonders, and I could say No way... SPB cannot reach IR's level for this song, and we could argue/discuss forever....though this discussion is perfectly sensible, its not very interesting,..
  
  So we have to spice it up by analysing extra factors : ego, pandering, plain stupidity, what else?
  
  Are Absolutes or Total Absence our only options? My interest is evaluation (and while this may seem academic or elitist) I believe this is what helps us reach some sort of understanding of excellence, aids us in separating the grains from the stones.
  
  What are you talking about? As a music listener, I see no purpose in setting standards. It is for the musician to decide. As a creator, he produces for us to consume. For that we pay him. Nobody has the right (why, ability) to define standards for everyone as far as music is concerned, because it is an intensely personal thing. Ditto for literature.
  
  Should the government must laws to maintain "quality" of music? (I think the Mumbai govt might have already done so, restricting their composers to only compose a Dm-C type chord progression in ALL their songs ;-)
  
  Anyways, keep the disussion going guys...
  
  
• From: spectator (@ 134.117.82.39) on: Sat Apr 13 18:51:19 EDT 2002
  
  head spinning here:-)
  
  
• From: hahaha (@ 172.180.0.122) on: Sat Apr 13 19:35:35 EDT 2002
  
  maybe, the MD is forced to sing his own composition when every singer on earth refuses to sing.
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Sat Apr 13 22:06:47 EDT 2002
  
  Well, isn't it a shame, Hari, that all this is not sensible but - where's the garam masala? I'm doing my best man :-) (Why are people so demanding?...read on...) :-))
  Just wondering how you arrived at that conclusion? Subjectivity? Some personal standards of what constitutes "interesting," or what's "boring" - for you? Your spice bar is a tad higher?
  An inadvertent (and yet revealing moment) your summation of this thread: the thoughts of posters here, the tenor of the discussion, the way it is proceeding, oh man, why doesn't it go any place exciting...like other threads?( comparison implied in the word "very" before "interesting," above.
  Oh dear, dear, dear - You are evaluating the thread!!
  I rest my case :-)
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Sat Apr 13 22:09:28 EDT 2002
  
  first line :all this is sensible but...
  Typo-vukku manikkavum.
  
  
• From: hari (@ 128.83.175.136) on: Sun Apr 14 02:43:31 EDT 2002
  
  naaz :-) happy thamizh new year and vishu btw.
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 193.188.97.152) on: Sun Apr 14 03:24:23 EDT 2002
  
  What looked like an ordinary thread is now threatening to become an intellectual battlefield!
  
  Could someone come out with the geo-political factors, Heuristic evaluation, medical background and unskewed psychosomatic reasons behind MDs singing..
  
  Naaz/Hari/arun_UK/AVR
  
  nangallem etho ezhigal,kai naatu,ariya pillaigal mannichu vitrunga!
  
  Cool it friends!Manamardha Iniya Puthandu Vazthukkal.
  
  
  
  
• From: arun_uk (@ 213.121.212.121) on: Sun Apr 14 07:48:57 EDT 2002
  
  OISG
  
  Ungalukkum Manamardha Iniya Puthandu Vazthukkal!
  
  "nangallem etho ezhigal,kai naatu,ariya pillaigal mannichu vitrunga"
  
  OSIG - Honestly I don't have any such feelings towards anyone on this forum or elsewhere & I am sure the same applies to others as well. Although lengthy and 'head-spinning'(like someone said) the discussions are healthy with no rude remarks,obscene comments or throwing tantrums by any of the participants here. That's good for a change isn't it?
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 193.188.97.152) on: Sun Apr 14 08:31:16 EDT 2002
  
  Head spinning i konjam vera Mozhiyila solla muyarchi seithen.
  
  Thanks for not getting angry!The exchanges were enjoyable despite occasional digressions.
  
  "nangallem etho ezhigal,kai naatu,ariya pillaigal mannichu vitrunga" -summa humility varuthannu parthen..that s all.
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Sun Apr 14 08:54:08 EDT 2002
  
  OISG, Hari - MY best wishes for a happy tamizh New Year and Vishukkani.
  
  Arun Kaetaar, Naan Sonnaen. Ingeyum thappa solliirundha - please, chinna vai, periya peychchunnu - mooththaava neega... konjam mannikkanum! :-)
  
  

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