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New Releases by ARR??

Topic started by Srikanth (@ passport.proxy.lucent.com) on Mon Sep 15 10:23:15 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Bharat (@ isdbsd1-inet.ci.mil.wi.us) on: Mon Aug 24 13:56:44 EDT 1998
  
  I watched the Hindi version. Great film. I thought MR had fine-tuned themes in Roja and Bombay to greater effect. The first half was a revelation, where conventional narrative structure is sacrificed for feverish dreamscape-like images that detail the development of facets of love of the hero. All of this is completely from SRK's point of view and very well-told. The second half becomes more conventional in structure, but remains very gripping. And I couldn't imagine a better end to the film.
  
  The whole film is told "Dil Se... " (from the heart) so much so that even most of the violence is emotional rather than physical (though there's a lot of the latter too). I was particularly thankful that there was no glib sermonizing (a la "oru thEviravAdhiyai manushanA mAththittE" in Roja, or the communal hand-holding of Bombay).
  
  Great camerawork, and choreography (that manages to show sensuality without the usual thrusting of body parts). I doubt I've seen another recent film that makes such extraordinary use of the "visual" power of cinema. And Mani Rathnam has also reined in SRK's tendency to go overboard.
  
  However, my only caveat was ARR's score (not the songs, those were terrific). I can't pinpoint what it was, but it just seemed midway between pedestrian and extraordinary. But this may just be my observation, for NOV seems to have enjoyed the score.
  
  The hindi version credited Sujatha for dialogue... any idea if he did write for both languages?
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Mon Aug 24 14:12:38 EDT 1998
  
  Nice review,Bharat.I like the fact that you see the first half as a dream-style narration where most reviewers settled for the usual "the first half meanders" response,sort of underscores the fact that a movie(or song) is to a good extent what you bring to it,subjective perception is all-important despite critics' pretense of "objectivity".
  
  A lot of people seemed to have a problem with Manisha's ambiguous behaviour,now seeming to be in love with Shah Rukh,now suddenly indifferent to him etc.Is there a critical response that can make sense of her behaviour or does Mani Ratnam fail in bringing to life an enigmatic French Lieutenant's Woman type of character(which I cant help feeling is what he was aiming for)?
  
  Sreeni.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Mon Aug 24 14:19:11 EDT 1998
  
  Sreeni, I might be making a digression here, but it was interesting to see you refer to French Lieutenant's Woman. Because, so far from what I read about the storyline, it seemed to me like a take on John Le Carre's "Little Drummer Girl".
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Mon Aug 24 14:39:51 EDT 1998
  
  Very interesting Udhaya,there again are those "subjective perceptions" i was referring to.I've not read the Le Carre novel but I have read(and re-read) "The French Lieutenant's Woman"(which had a terrific impact on me back in the days of yore),so that's what I was bringing to my apprehension of this movie.Now that you mention it the Le Carre novel does seem a more plausible take-off point except for the fact that its a more obscure novel than "The French..." and was never AFAIK filmed.
  
  So would you care to summarize the Le Carre novel for us?
  
  Thanks,
  Sreeni.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Mon Aug 24 15:55:36 EDT 1998
  
  Guys,
  Check out this Rahman interview on rediff,not very creative interviewing,nothing new really but ARR-fans gotta have their fix.
  
  http://www.rediff.co.in/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/;execmacro/music_content.d2w/report?fname=24rahman.htm
  
  
• From: Bharat (@ isdbsd1-inet.ci.mil.wi.us) on: Mon Aug 24 16:36:50 EDT 1998
  
  IFRC, Little drummer Girl was made into a film with Diane Keaton.
  
  I thought the pull Manisha had between her profession and personal lives was pretty obvious in "Dil Se". I cannot imagine people thought that Manisha's now-yes-now-no attitude was a problem. That was in fact the key to the whole film, and brings that much more madness to SRK's feelings, again underlying the passion in the story (Dil se...). After all, rational people surrender to irrationality when it comes to passion and SRK does just that.
  
  As far as French Lieutenant comparisons go, that film existed as a narrative experiment counterpointing two relationships in different ages. This one's set in one time period.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Mon Aug 24 16:48:41 EDT 1998
  
  Well I was referring to the character played by Meryl Streep who also appears very mysteriously to the hero,then proceeds to drive him mad with her unpredictable behaviour.Also the book has only one time period.
  
  To read one reviewer lamenting about Manisha's character,go to "movie reviews" here-
  
  http://www.indolink.com/bollywood/indexhg.html
  
  
• From: Bharat (@ isdbsd1-inet.ci.mil.wi.us) on: Mon Aug 24 17:00:41 EDT 1998
  
  Sreeni:
  The film has a Meryl Streep/Jeremy Irons combo that are the book's protagonists, and another Streep/Irons combo as actors portraying the earlier pair's lives. The film uses this to achieve a back-and-forth-in-time effect that's fascinating. Taken from her behavior, the compasrison with Manisha in Dil Se does seem similar.
  
  BTW, are you doing a Dil se watch on the internet :-)?
  
  
• From: Anand Mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com) on: Mon Aug 24 17:03:44 EDT 1998
  
  I thought we discussed about music in this fourm.Please stick to music in your posting.
  There are other forums to discuss mani rathnam's exploits as a director.
  
  Anand mahadevan
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Mon Aug 24 17:09:00 EDT 1998
  
  Sreeni:
  The film has a Meryl Streep/Jeremy Irons combo that are the book's protagonists, and
  another Streep/Irons combo as actors portraying the earlier pair's lives.
  
  Right Bharat.
  
  BTW, are you doing a Dil se watch on the internet?
  
  Right again,with a few directors like Mani Ratnam,Ramgopal Varma and some others I tend to do webscans as a substitute for the informal film-discussion groups that I used to participate in with friends(who're now scattered across the globe).
  
  Sreeni.
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ inet20.us.oracle.com) on: Mon Aug 24 18:46:19 EDT 1998
  
  I agree with NOV. ARR improved a lot on BGM. The only things I liked in the movie is Photography and Music. I had plenty of time to observe the BGM (thanks to Mani Ratnam!!). ARR was far better than his earlier movies. Though I found some trace of Daud/Ottam song in the BGM (which constitutes only 5% of BGM), it's fine.
  
  Similarly, I found traces of the song (telephone manipol from Indian) in Roja and some of his later compositions in Roja. This is past!!!
  
  
• From: Anand mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com) on: Tue Aug 25 14:51:21 EDT 1998
  
  "dil se re" sounds very close to "Mehbooba Mehbooba" from sholay.
  
  Anand Mahadevan
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Tue Aug 25 16:52:44 EDT 1998
  
  "dil se re" sounds very close to "Mehbooba Mehbooba" from sholay.
  
  Good joke!
  
  
• From: Anand Mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com) on: Tue Aug 25 17:20:17 EDT 1998
  
  I am not sure wether my comment had any jocular sense but I certainly found them close in terms of the melody.I have heard 'Dil se re' only once,perhaps I am wrong.
  
  
• From: Sanjay (@ tntport0496.toj.com) on: Wed Aug 26 01:08:37 EDT 1998
  
  Anand, r u sure u don't mean that
  "satrangi re" soundsl like "mehbooba mehbooba"
  
  
• From: Sanjay (@ tntport0496.toj.com) on: Wed Aug 26 01:12:04 EDT 1998
  
  To those who have seen the DIL SE film -
  
  2 questions on song picturization,
  
  1. Was the thaiya thaiya REMIX featured ( and how ) ?
  
  2. The 1st interlude in Jiya jale where the tempo changes....how was it picturized ?
  
  Thank you.
  
  
• From: neeks (@ host67066.cfu.net) on: Wed Aug 26 01:15:29 EDT 1998
  
  Sanjay -
  
  the thaiya thaiya REMIX was not featured
  
  jiya jale was picturized switching back and forth from a wedding in delhi to a dream sequence in kerela
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ unknown-196-133.beasys.com) on: Fri Aug 28 14:41:15 EDT 1998
  
  I just caught up with Dil Se and I'd like to ask people,whats GOING ON with Rahman's background score?Opera(sometimes with tabla backing,sometimes without) in Assam,strings in Ladakh,synths in Delhi,muezzin wails throughout,what does it all mean?Does it cohere or make any sort of statement?Does Mani know whats going on?I think not,if he did he wouldnt have picturised the Lata song on Preity Zinta for gods sake,he wouldnt have maltreated "Eh Ajnabi" the way he does and he
  would have made sure that snatches of the title song are repeated sometimes in the
  score,excuse me but isnt that what title songs are usually there for?Or maybe he should have titled the movie "Eh Ajnabi"!
  
  Does even Rahman know what he's doing?OK in the past I've appreciated his appropriately post-modernist collage-type score for movies like Thiruda Thiruda etc as an advance over(or at least a change from) IR's more traditional but nevertheless gorgeously tonal flow.But here he appears clueless,he's also not much helped
  by the fact that Dil Se treads much the same territory as the other two entries
  in Mani's political/romantic tryptich,here again are those solemn terrorists striking mysterious pacts in dimly-lit shacks,the shaky camera depicting army-raids,the camera revolving dizzyingly as protagonists spew humanist/extremist dialectics and so many other familiar elements.How often can you compose for these situations and still come up fresh as roses?
  
  More specifically the the rapid changes of location with built-in travelogue aspects and also the huge cast of characters,many playing relatively brief roles(the flute-playing terrorist,Mita Vashisht etc) militates against the realisation of a consistent score with a solidly designed integrity.In this situation,whether you score by location or by character the music will end up seeming fragmentary and/or confused.Well this is what happens with Dil Se's score.
  
  What then is the solution?Its either very complex involving an eclectic orchestra of instruments and samples of course(this being 1998) developing and varying on a great number of themes all interwoven into a rich tapestry like Korngold's score for The Sea Hawk.Or you could totally take the opposite minimalist route,pick a restricted palette of sounds,largely ignore changes in location and character and compose something like Tangerine Dream's scores for movies like Legend or Risky Business.
  
  The first requires considerable resources and time(though Korngold churned out some of his best scores in 2-3 weeks having a considerable background in classical composition).Rahman doesnt have the time or the skills required for such composition obviously,his solution has been to develop this unique hybrid of synth doodling,wails and shouts,song-snippets etc.
  
  The second Tangerine Dream method is already dated from a Hollywood point of view but definitely needs to be attempted(especially now that Rahman's collage method seems so tired) in the Indian context,with just Indian instrumentation or a mix of Indian and western sounds.Of course some equivalent has been attempted in art movies I think.Does anyone know of any examples?
  
  
• From: junior (@ proxy2c.emirates.net.ae) on: Sun Aug 30 07:15:35 EDT 1998
  
  now lets get back to topic:
  Is ARR the md for padayappa?
  Rumors are that ARR has a simply fascinating score for rythm(surprise surprise)
  
  

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