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Ilayaraja copy adiththa paadalgal

Topic started by Rajaraman (@ 192.122.136.148) on Sat Jul 26 05:27:10 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: lottu (@ global22.citicorp.com) on: Wed Mar 24 10:33:22 EST 1999
  
  yappa Unni, how can you bring "ARR copies" in this thread, by agreeing with me ??????
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ kcecfp02.sprint.com) on: Wed Mar 24 10:41:02 EST 1999
  
  Raj, Srinath, Madhan & Other IR fans,
  
  Unni's quote "(IR, No.1)" - Let it go. You guys have other work to do.
  
  
• From: Mr.Kuzapam (@ 206.139.13.152) on: Wed Mar 24 10:59:11 EST 1999
  
  Annan Srikanth -- Bulti adithuvitar...I thought he was a hcArrF, anyway - I still have reservation for Arr in my musical world.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Wed Mar 24 11:22:42 EST 1999
  
  rajaG: No...ooooo. I wasnt accusing you of anything. Well, you were one person who I thought would take kindly to harmless leg-pulling. Sorry if I sounded like preaching..I mean , No political correctness here, genuine , honest regret. Cra* is not profanity, sure, buddy(oh! I seem to have taken a liking to this term...and I dont like it:)). I guess I must keep a watch on my feet...
  Sorry again if I conveyed the impression of chiding/correcting/preaching to you.
  Sorry,Sorry, Sorry.
  
  And I am glad and hopeful it is over:))
  
  
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Wed Mar 24 11:28:55 EST 1999
  
  rajaG: Sure as the next thing:)). I dont have the energy to take on every jhonny-come-lately. I myself was one not too long ago. Which was why I was foolish enough to waste time trying to convince people to take my line. And when these new jhonnies are doing precisely the same now, I know enough to sit back and enjoy just as you guys probably did with me:))). See what happens..Kuzhappam is under the impression that Srikanth is a HCARRF:)))
  Welcome me to the fold of seniors, guys:))
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ ss08.nc.us.ibm.com) on: Wed Mar 24 12:23:01 EST 1999
  
  Raj:
  I don't know if you need to learn to be as large-hearted as Srinath, but you definitely have to learn to be as clever ;-) There is a victory to be gained in every surrender - Thus Spake Srinath !
  
  Welcome to the seniors fold ! :-)))
  
  
• From: Sudhakar G (@ aegis.bst.bellsouth.com) on: Wed Mar 24 16:31:04 EST 1999
  
  Hi Guys,
  
  Has the similiarity in the starting lines of "Chittukuruvi vetkap' padudhu" (Chinna Veedu) & a Western classical piece been discussed in this thread before? (Sorry, I have no clue who the composer was for the Western Classical piece. I listened to this piece in CNN)
  
  
• From: vijay (@ homer.ece.sc.edu) on: Wed Mar 24 20:59:42 EST 1999
  
  sudhakar,
  i think yes, if u check the old responses.i guess it has been inspired from Dvorak's symphony.
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Thu Mar 25 10:53:16 EST 1999
  
  Srinath: Cleverness never was one of my vices:)). By your philosophies, I have had several victories in my Life:)))
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ ss07.nc.us.ibm.com) on: Thu Mar 25 11:43:24 EST 1999
  
  Victory is a state of the mind :-) If I feel happier at having let go, I am the victor !
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Thu Mar 25 11:48:28 EST 1999
  
  Srinath: Engayo poyittappa:)). However, I am mostly Peter(U) rathr than Victor:)))
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Sat Mar 27 06:29:58 EST 1999
  
  Thnaks Unni, my sentiments exactly. Madhan is not happy with a comment I made earlier and is trying to wrongly make me look stupid. Never mind, I'm getting a hard shell towards Personal Attacks now.
  
  FYI, all, I did make a statement which was out of retaliation to something else, saying that IR copied 1 whole song whilst ARR has only used bought samples in some of his songs. I could have used Deva as a prime example to show the difference b/w a copy and an inspiration, but didn't.... Sorry about that. I seems to have stemmed a lot of argument.
  
  Personally, I feel that all MD's have 'influence', IR having Western Classical, ARR having Pop, G Ramanathan having the Great Carnatic Trinity e.t.c. After 2 years of reading this page, and extensive listening, IR is one who may be influenced, but DEFINITELY NOT a 'copier' like Deva, however, ARR too has influence, but he BUYS the samples of a lot of the stuff, which seems similar/same, this is allowed, in my book, anyway.
  I am a follower of Both IR and ARR, but neither pays my way, so in this DF, I can say what I like, be it liked by many or not. The fact is that, if I feel that something is nto 'right' in anyone's music, I can comment on it, I have stood corrected many a time, and accept that.
  
  My comments, however, do not merit personal attacks by anyone(singling me out, e.t.c.), as I often say. I have noticed that if RajaG makes a statement and I back it with some embellishment, just as a second opinion, people like Raj/Shankar will pounce on what I say, just as Madhan dod not react to RajaG correcting him, but had a very big problem with me doing it. IS THIS RIGHT? IS THIS FAIR? I THINK NOT. I have as many rights to correct or comment as any other DFer. Please adhere to this fact. Thank you.
  
  Madhan: Yes I do come into threads when I can, like you, this is because I have a job and I'm a consultant, I have to travel and can only 'surf' when I get a chance to, i.e. mostly on weekends. My comment to you was to say, please don't make yourself look 'silly' by making inaccurate comments and also, by sticking to your guns about Mohanam being Yaman, it makes both you and your Mirudangam friend look bad. That was my point. I too have many friends who paly the Mirudangam. Very few are well versed in the Raga aspect. I have been catching Ragas since I was a child, mainly because of the variety of songs produced by IR and I will forever be grateful to him for that, but, at the same time, I do listen to all music, Deva's and all, so refuse to 'blindly' worship him. If you notice, I do not blindly worship ARR either. When his BGM 'sucked' in Fire, I was one of the few to point it out.....Please realise this and take any personal problems you have with my postings to e-mail. The same goes to others, if the need be.
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Sat Mar 27 06:30:12 EST 1999
  
  Thanks Unni, my sentiments exactly. Madhan is not happy with a comment I made earlier and is trying to wrongly make me look stupid. Never mind, I'm getting a hard shell towards Personal Attacks now.
  
  FYI, all, I did make a statement which was out of retaliation to something else, saying that IR copied 1 whole song whilst ARR has only used bought samples in some of his songs. I could have used Deva as a prime example to show the difference b/w a copy and an inspiration, but didn't.... Sorry about that. I seems to have stemmed a lot of argument.
  
  Personally, I feel that all MD's have 'influence', IR having Western Classical, ARR having Pop, G Ramanathan having the Great Carnatic Trinity e.t.c. After 2 years of reading this page, and extensive listening, IR is one who may be influenced, but DEFINITELY NOT a 'copier' like Deva, however, ARR too has influence, but he BUYS the samples of a lot of the stuff, which seems similar/same, this is allowed, in my book, anyway.
  I am a follower of Both IR and ARR, but neither pays my way, so in this DF, I can say what I like, be it liked by many or not. The fact is that, if I feel that something is nto 'right' in anyone's music, I can comment on it, I have stood corrected many a time, and accept that.
  
  My comments, however, do not merit personal attacks by anyone(singling me out, e.t.c.), as I often say. I have noticed that if RajaG makes a statement and I back it with some embellishment, just as a second opinion, people like Raj/Shankar will pounce on what I say, just as Madhan dod not react to RajaG correcting him, but had a very big problem with me doing it. IS THIS RIGHT? IS THIS FAIR? I THINK NOT. I have as many rights to correct or comment as any other DFer. Please adhere to this fact. Thank you.
  
  Madhan: Yes I do come into threads when I can, like you, this is because I have a job and I'm a consultant, I have to travel and can only 'surf' when I get a chance to, i.e. mostly on weekends. My comment to you was to say, please don't make yourself look 'silly' by making inaccurate comments and also, by sticking to your guns about Mohanam being Yaman, it makes both you and your Mirudangam friend look bad. That was my point. I too have many friends who paly the Mirudangam. Very few are well versed in the Raga aspect. I have been catching Ragas since I was a child, mainly because of the variety of songs produced by IR and I will forever be grateful to him for that, but, at the same time, I do listen to all music, Deva's and all, so refuse to 'blindly' worship him. If you notice, I do not blindly worship ARR either. When his BGM 'sucked' in Fire, I was one of the few to point it out.....Please realise this and take any personal problems you have with my postings to e-mail. The same goes to others, if the need be.
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ 1cust10.tnt10.chi5.da.uu.net) on: Sat Mar 27 12:49:58 EST 1999
  
  Geetha Just cool down, this fight here is never ending story, many IR fans have started to see only IR rather than his music. His music has taken back seat. For Madhan, he gets excited when some one says things about IR.
  It is funny to see Mohanam being Yaman, frankly these kinds of arguments reduces the spirit of DF
  Franly IR scores have drastically come down in the past few years, he is not thinking., (guys my above comment will not reduce IR's greatness even by an inch.), this is my opinion, his drum parts, bass parts and his arrangement litrally sucks. Please stop this childish fight.
  IR fans are trying to defend for everything people post here. , that leads to a fight.
  
  Srikanth (from my friends pc)
  
  
  
• From: Velaiyaththavan (@ 129.252.23.30) on: Sat Mar 27 13:38:01 EST 1999
  
  mohanam has become madhan's "yaman" in the DF...:-))
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ daecfp01.sprint.com) on: Sat Mar 27 15:02:43 EST 1999
  
  Velaiyaththavan,
  
  engEyO..........pOyitteenga!!!
  
  
• From: Madhan, Goa. (@ 202.41.117.63) on: Sun Mar 28 12:19:16 EST 1999
  
  
  "Mohanam" being " Yaman " - I have already made a statement that as far as Carnatic music is concerned, my knowledge is SOONYAM - hence, I had to fall back on my friend's opinion - well, looks like my friend (and he is not fictional, as RajaG has claimed !!) was /is wrong.
  In a way, I have at least gainfully learned that Mohanam is not Yaman and vice versa and never to make statements without cross checking at least with three knowledgeable guys/gals .
  
  So, again, I stand corrected as far as Mohanam being Yaman is concerned.
  
  "Madhan is not happy with a comment I made earlier and is trying to make me look stupid " -
  take a closer look at your posting - my statement on Mohanam being Yaman was and is INDEED WRONG - but let us see what you have posted -
  
  "MADHAN: Where did you get this info. from? I know you love IR, but this information is WRONG?!?!? And, to post it twice? What are you thinking????? It really makes you look bad"
  
  Now, the OBJECTIVE here is NOT ONLY to show that I am wrong , but in a way,it suggests that, BECAUSE I LOVE IR, MY INFO. IS WRONG !! How else would one (or at least me) interpret your words ?
  
  " And posting it twice " - now here what does this got to do with my statement on Mohanam ? !
  
  Isn't this propensity/ proclivity to find a mistake and then correlate with everything else in a posting, irrespective of whether a correlation exists or not , a hallmark of a person hellbent on finding a mistake at any cost ?! So, why shouldn't I be unhappy with a posting like yours ?!
  
  In the thread on "Raga on songs" , the same Geetha has posted TWICE, today,i.e., Sunday, 28th March, 1999. Geetha's finger may have been hyperactive on the keyboard, but would she take it in her stride, if someone were to come along and accuse her for "being hard-headed enough to impose her ideas on others by posting a contribution TWICE in the same thread " ??!
  
  
  "I am also at doubt at your comment that Oru Kanam is in Mohanam....." - well, would you be kind enough to tell me the exact Raag on which "Oru kanam" is based ? If one compares and contrasts "Ninnukori varnam" from Agni Nakshatiram, "Vel muruganukku mottai onnu podapporen " from another movie and "Oru kanam oru yugamaaga" , they all have several similarities - if someone can tell me which Raaga is the base for the other two songs, then MAYBE , the Raaga base for Oru kanam can be ascertained.
  
  As for me not being happy with an earlier posting of yours - we have already had a round of e-mailing, in which I have been overtly polite in trying to explain things to you regarding the "Darling, Darling" song from PRIYA - but after my last E-mail to you in which I had so specifically clarified the reason as to why Darling song cannot be called a total COPY note be note, as you had claimed, there was no reply from your side, either refuting or accepting my clarification - but instead, you have brought the same issue here all over again !!
  
  "For Madhan, he gets excited when some one says things about IR"-so,what does this imply ? tomorrow, some Tom, Smith and Harry would come along and browse our DF (with a chewing gum in his mouth ) and go through our postings and chuckle and say " Oh! Who is this chap called IR ? another of those 'clonkers' from India claiming to be a mystic genius ? " and then turns around and tells his mates , " Guys, these Indians smell a lot rotten - I thought they had some original stuff " - maybe, for Srikanth, this may not mean a thing - but, definitely I am not going to take things lying down, if someone were to make statements on a man, whose creations have given people like me a cultural and native identity - in other words, I am just saying that I GOT A LOT OF SELF - RESPECT and any person with a SELF-RESPECT worth his/her salt, would / should get "excited" indeed.
  
  Why don't any of the DFers try telling a Bengali guy/girl that Tagore is not original and that some of his compositions resemble some earlier composition of somebody else's ? I will give it to you in writing, you won't get an EXCITED response, you will end up with a bleeding nose . This is not to bring any kind of insult to anybody else , but I am trying to share with you the intensity of passion we have for Raja and his creations .
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ 98ab3d04.ipt.aol.com) on: Sun Mar 28 13:06:32 EST 1999
  
  Madhan:
  Though I am not entirely happy with your outbursts, I strongly condemn the attitude of Geetha and RajaG towards your mistake.
  
  Geetha:
  You seem to suffer from a persecution complex. Your gender has very little to do with the so-called attacks on you. You have an opinion that is not to the liking of some people here, that's all. As Madhan has pointed out, his love for IR and accidental double posting have nothing to do with his knowledge of raagas. Your post ridiculing Madhan would have been well within accepted norms and a strong statement in your favour if not for those two claims (Madhan's love for IR and the double posting) which reduced the effect that you have otherwise achieved by simply using your knowledge. If you are not convinced, try posting with a different name (male or neutral like observer, neruppu etc) in the DF for a while. My guess is that you will continue to face as much opposition for your favourable views of ARR. It is your opinion that is not liked or accepted by some here (including me). I am sure that as a person you are as good as any here. Have a nice time in France and don't let a public discussion linger in your mind long enough to upset you :-)
  
  

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