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New Releases by ARR??

Topic started by Srikanth (@ passport.proxy.lucent.com) on Mon Sep 15 10:23:15 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: SitaRam (@ portal.ameritech.com) on: Wed Jul 28 12:36:49 EDT 1999
  
  Geetha, why is that ARR whose knowledge of orchestration and harmony compared to IR seems so poor is getting attention from the likes of Maurice Jarre and Webber and why IR is not even there? Can you help clarify this? I have yet to hear any level of complex orchestration from any Indian composer. ARR does not even compare anywhere near Laxmikant Pyarelal. Sorry to say this, but I personally feel that ARR's orchestration is bland and shallow. All songs of ARR are easily imitable whereas to compose in IR of his early days, I feel there is no emulation possible. (IR of the 90s is imitable, that is a different point as he changed his style dramatically for the worse.) But, again I always felt that IR could do something like Maurice Jarre asin the movie Lawrence Of Arabia. ARR, what is he going to do with Maurice Jarre? No contempt here, I know ARR is doing greating learning things, but I feel sad that such colloborations were not initiated by IR for international audience.
  
  
• From: Madhan (@ 202.41.117.62) on: Wed Jul 28 13:06:13 EDT 1999
  
  Sitaram,
  
  WAIT and WATCH !! IR is going to have a great , real, big time breakthrough !!
  
  For more info., send e-mail to me - I don't want to divulge anything here
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ kcecfp02.sprint.com) on: Wed Jul 28 14:32:02 EDT 1999
  
  Sitaram,
  
  "ARR does not even compare anywhere near Laxmikant Pyarelal"- Are you serious ? IMO, the big three of TFM - MSV, IR and ARR are infinitely better than all Hindi Film MDs who came after RDB, and can definitely hold their own compared to HFM MDs before (and including) RDB's time. You give me instances of "fantastic compositions" of LP and I will give you twice that many from any of the big three in Tamil.
  
  
• From: SitaRam (@ portal.ameritech.com) on: Wed Jul 28 16:51:26 EDT 1999
  
  rajaG, honestly ARR's trademark is only his surprising catchy tunes, but orcehstration is definitely crude and limited. LP were a class act and I definitely preferred their style in their great films (bobby, hero, roti kapada aur makkan - the song mein na bolunga, etc..) to that of RDB or others. S-Ganesh, V Kumar and others were also more sophisticated and subtle than ARR. I would say let us leave ARR out as a unique with whatever little he offers but brilliant only for the exceptional strangeness and catchiness of some of his hit songs.
  
  Madhan, I can't wait. Let me tell you IR does not need to work with any other greats, maybe ARR should and age is on his side for such tag along type work. Also, IR has not accomplished less on his own that he would have achieved by working with other greats. IR is one who can do anything all on his own. But he needs some motivation at this stage in his career.
  
  Geetha, your comments please!
  
  
• From: suren (@ ad12-s15-202-111.cwci.net) on: Wed Jul 28 18:42:25 EDT 1999
  
  I really thought that IR was involved with a composer called john scott, who actually did the music for "Lawrence of Arabia".
  Anyway I am curious about this Geetha`s ID.Is she one of those sisters of suhasini who is a peadiatrician in UK?
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Thu Jul 29 05:08:09 EDT 1999
  
  Suren: Certainly not! I am from Sri Lanka and bear no relation to Suhasini or anyone in the film world!
  
  The John Scott you speak about s the guy who lead the Symphonic Fantasy by IR, he's with the St. Pauls Choir now.
  
  SitaRam: Will get back to you later!
  
  Madhan: Please divulge ASAP, it sounds extremely
  interesting!
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Thu Jul 29 05:09:14 EDT 1999
  
  Suren: For more about me, please see my web page:
  
  www.members.tripod.com/~ygeetha
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Thu Jul 29 05:12:19 EDT 1999
  
  Suren, also, I don't think that a Doctor will be posting from an Oracle UK domain!
  
  You posting is highly amusing though :-)
  
  
• From: dev mannemela (@ prxy-01.softimage.com) on: Thu Jul 29 11:54:31 EDT 1999
  
  Sitaram,
  
  ARR's orchestrations are crude ??
  Surely you jest.
  
  and LP is a class act compared to RGB and others ?? I am sure LP would be delighted to hear this and pronounce you the head of their fan club with immediate effect..
  
  What kind of orchestration had LP excelled in ?
  They had one specific style - to use loud dholaks
  in a "stereophonic" style ! I can't believe some one mentions LP's name when talking about complex orchestration...
  
  I would be delighted if you can give us more details and specific examples of any of LP's 'complex' orchestrations..
  
  Dev
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Thu Jul 29 13:51:47 EDT 1999
  
  Sitaram: I agree with Dev. I don't know too much of LP's music, but I can't say that anything I have heard has impressed me in the least. You must still be of the impression that the HFM guys have more talent than TFM guys(except IR, as oyu've mentioned), remember who's copying from who nowadays!
  
  By the way, nice to see you back Dev.
  
  Sitaram, I think you also got your wires crossed, ARR mentioned corraborating with John Michelle Jarre(French Guy, of Synthesiser fame), not Maurice Jarre!
  
  
• From: SRK (@ tan7.ncr.com) on: Thu Jul 29 14:01:32 EDT 1999
  
  Folks: sorry for the goof up! I misread what ARR said in the interview and thought it was Maurice Jarre.
  
  Can anybody tell me what is JMJ famous for?
  
  
• From: bb (@ inehou-pxy04.compaq.com) on: Thu Jul 29 14:25:14 EDT 1999
  
  the oxygene guy?
  
  
• From: Venkat (@ pg1proxy.pg.com) on: Thu Jul 29 14:43:03 EDT 1999
  
  yes, bb. I dont know much about him though. His web site is http://www.jarre.com/
  
  Later
  
  
• From: Anand Prasad Santhanam (@ 1cust99.tnt1.smyrna.ga.da.uu.net) on: Thu Jul 29 14:44:39 EDT 1999
  
  Hi there,
  Regarding IRs latest releases, have u heard of " BHARANI ". If not then don't miss a song titled " Thena oodum oda karaiyil ". I feel if IR really tries to make all songs like that, then he will be again in big charts.
  
  
• From: cram (@ 206.103.12.102) on: Fri Jul 30 09:07:12 EDT 1999
  
  dev,
  listen to the music of Ek Duje ke Liye, Utsav and Bobby. i'm sure L-P will rise in ur esteem.
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ daecfp01.sprint.com) on: Fri Jul 30 10:46:23 EDT 1999
  
  Cram,
  Let's take Bobby. No, I am not complaining that they are bad songs. But what unique or great orchestration did you find in them ?
  
  mei shaayar thO nahin - standard run of the mill chords and the Raj Kapoor trademark tune (used umpteen times earlier, say Jeena Yahaan Marna Yahaan for example)in both the prelude and second interlude music. I am talking about the "pa Ni sa ri, Ni pa ga, ri sa pa.. phrase which was stolen by Shankar Jaikishen from Under Paris Skies (a very good accordion piece).
  
  MujHe kuch kehna hai - standard mishra darbaari tune - The melody is good but what's your point about orchestration. Did you notice any unique strings or bass structure to the song? Try to sing this song with 'maar diyaa jaay, yaa cHod diyaa jaay' from mEra gaaon meraa desh. Similar tune isn't it?
  
  Please don't sell the talents off ARR short by comparing him to very ordinary MDs like LP and KA. These MDs resort to Shivaranjani, Piloo, darbari and keeravaani over and over and over to give the 'public' 'super hits' and have very limited talent/knowledge/compositions beyond that. To get to involved orchestration, you have to cross the first step of non-standard melodies.
  
  Dev Mannemala is absolutely right - LP's talents lie only in sterophonic Dholoks. Having said that, I will agree that Utsav was a very good effort, but exceptions, as you know, prove the rule.
  
  
• From: Sridhar Seetharaman (@ 192.4.230.254) on: Fri Jul 30 11:58:59 EDT 1999
  
  rajaG,
  
  BTW, Bobby's tunes were composed by Shankar JaiKishen. This news appeared in "Ilustrated weekly" just after Raj Kapoor's death. LP is a curse to Hindhi film music. Nobody has produced more cacophony than LP. Fantastic instrument like Dholak was put to death by these guys. The tradition of LP is carried on by Nadeem-Shravan, Jatin-Lalit and Anand-Millind. It is inappropriate to compare ARR, RAJA and MSV with these cacophony specialists.
  
  
• From: Sridhar Seetharaman (@ 192.4.230.254) on: Fri Jul 30 12:04:48 EDT 1999
  
  The music of Ek Duje ke Liye, Hero is utter nonsense. Non stop String runs (LP treat strings like harmonium). Whatevr they play along in harmonium when they compose the tune is played with strings. Bad counterpoints which bother your ears all the time. It is sad that likes of LP sideline brilliant composers like Vishal Bharadwaj. Listen to Vishal's lata composition in "Hu Tu Tu". Nobody has used Kadri Gopalnath, the saxophone master better than Vishal (not even ARR). It is unfortunate that Vishal did not get the due recognition.
  
  
• From: hari (@ hud04a01.ml.com) on: Fri Jul 30 13:58:55 EDT 1999
  
  sitaram,
  Now withstanding all this outpour against LP by ragag, and SL, I like to say, I enjoyed lot of
  LP orchestrations, But I dont agree with you whether they are better than ARR. IMO, Lp melody and orchestrations are enjoyable, and My illiterate ear, can't identify counterpoints or other technical matters luckily :-).
  In hero in the song - 'ding dong', the second interlude is very good. I have enjoyed their music
  in Ek duje keliya, mr.india, and even tezab ( sho gaya eh jagha) . One of my fav. non-iR music in 80s from LP - uyire unnakaga.
  
  e.hari
  
  Sriram lakshman;- I remeber reading in one of the magazines after one of them died recently (is it pyarilal), that Rajkapoor approached LP for bobby with three already composed tunes. It is no wonder they sounded familiar.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ dhcp-css-consult-12.redbrick.com) on: Fri Jul 30 20:43:39 EDT 1999
  
  Hari, Intha thread-la naan oNNume ezhuthaliye:-)
  Sorry to hurt your sentiments, but I feel that LP are the most overrated MDs IFM ever produced. I agree with Sridhar about their orchestration in general and Pyarelal was considered to be Asia's best arranger by the Hindi filmwallas:-)
  
  I have heard that too (about Bobby) but the SJ trade mark is missing in the tunes. The trademark is nothing to be proud about, it would typically have the tune for a single line being repeated 5 times in the stanzas and the pallavi would start again and the song would not have anupallavi at all.All this mean that SJ had to compose only 2 lines worth of tune for a song. This becomes inexcuseable because, Shankar (the more active partner in RK movies) preferred to compose the tune first and the lyrics would be thrust into it.
  90% of their songs in their whole career fall in this category . At the most , the stanzas might extend to 4 lines and sound awfully simplistic like in 'Dil ke Jharoken mein' and Raju Bharathan had the gal to call MSV-TKR and the South Indian Shankar-Jaikishen team. Coming back to the point, LP could have atleast copied SJ's style of arrangement in Bobby. BTW,I think LP should be given the credit for insulting violins to the maximum extent possible.
  
  ARR,IR and MSV are three of the very best in India ever.
  
  
  
  
• From: Kalanjiyam (@ proxy1.qatar.net.qa) on: Sat Jul 31 14:58:17 EDT 1999
  
  I object my friends. Agreed that IR is the best. and follows ARR. But MSV is no where near the first two. May be he is melody mannar, but in orchestration he is totally zero. this might hurt someone but I should say that. so, the result,
  
  IR and ARR are the great composers in India.
  
  
  

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