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Ilayaraja copy adiththa paadalgal

Topic started by Rajaraman (@ 192.122.136.148) on Sat Jul 26 05:27:10 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Madhan, Goa. (@ 202.41.117.63) on: Tue Mar 23 12:42:12 EST 1999
  
  
  I am back after quite some time :
  
  First my posting regarding "AAGAYA VENNILAAVEY" based on CHAALA NAATTAI - some half a decade ago , a Carnatic music savvy friend of mine, based in Chennai, told me about AV being based on Chaala Naattai -
  
  my knowledge of Carnatic music is soonyam ! so, I quoted my friend's observation - and hence I stand corrected now.
  
  Well, after my posting equating Mohanam with Yaman (Hindustani), a lot of heat was generated - for instance, one Ms.Geetha has written thus :
  
  " MADHAN: Where did you get this info. from? I know you love IR, but this information is WRONG?!?!? And, to post it twice? What are you thinking????? It really makes you look bad, whereas you're trying to make a point, a good one at that.
  
  "Listened to "Oru Kanam oru yugamaaga" from NADODI THENDRAL ? It was "inspired" from Mohana Raagam (Raag Yaman in Hindustani classical) - so, again did Raja copy from some source?"
  
  WRONG AGAIN.....Mohanam is Bhoop in Hindustani, whilst Yaman is a version of MechaKalyani - Also known as Yaman Kalyani(NRGMDNRS SNDPMGRNRS is one[of many controversial] Aarohanam Avarohanam of this lovely Ragam), popular song being Krishna Nee Beghane Baaro FYI, as RajaG said, on both accounts. I am also at doubt at your comment that Oru Kanam is in Mohanam....."
  
  I have been very sincerely trying to ascertain the validity of my statement - my friend , a practicising MRudangist , tells me that MOHANAM is indeed YAMAN !! this person has been playing the MRIDANG for a long time , so he should be having some knowledge , if not as WIDE and BROAD A KNOWLEDGE OF MUSIC, that Ms.Geetha seems to be possessing !
  
  And, "ORU KANAM ORU YUGAMAAGA" is indeed Mohanam - my friend confirmed this to me !
  
  Ms.Geetha has cultivated this rather strange habit of sporadically jumping into this thread , finding some mistake and then vanishing !!
  
  Reminds me of the MALABAR beedi advt. which keeps flitting in and out of the screen, while watching the pirated version of a new movie in a Video Cassette Player !!
  
  
• From: Mr.Kuzapam (@ 206.139.13.152) on: Tue Mar 23 12:43:49 EST 1999
  
  Raj - Thalasuthudhu --- what happened, though being on the enemy ranks I love the way you reply ,but now it is disappointing.
  
  ---- >For the 2 copied songs I put -- try to find Video for Dutches and dirtwater fox in block buster and hear the theme score, yes it is enjodi manaja kurvee.
  
  Denying all the facts will not wipe away anything.
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 13:30:29 EST 1999
  
  Alright KuzahppaM; Make it 3+1.
  1.Kanavu Kaanum
  2.Enn jodi manjakuruvi (COurtesy Kuzhappam)
  3.Darling Darling
  4. ???
  So, what is your conclusion?
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ ss07.nc.us.ibm.com) on: Tue Mar 23 13:42:57 EST 1999
  
  Hari:
  I expressed the idea of leaving things alone almost 1 year back in this very same thread ! Please read... :-)
  
  From: Srinath (@ socks7d.raleigh.ibm.com) on: Wed Jun 24 15:05:32 EDT 1998
  Madhan:
  I agreed with Prakash on one of his replies to my post. I felt his comments didn't merit a response and he asked me to ignore them if I felt that way. I went ahead and took his advice. One thing I love about these passionate discussions is the enormous amount of information (in the form of facts and rumours) that they bring out. I really enjoyed all your points but I felt you were a little too harsh on Prakash :-) If we IR fans keep reacting to comments like this, we'll end up with ulcers. The best reponse would be 'no response'. That way we can allow these baseless rumours to die the insignificant death that they deserve.
  
  
  From: Madhan (@ 202.41.117.11) on: Wed Jun 24 15:33:02 EDT 1998
  (partially reproduced)
  MR.Srinath : We should remember that this is an open DF which can be read by anybody in the world. That being the case, how can you expect me to ignore some blatant blaspehemies on IR ? if proper replies are not given, an outsider, say, a third party, who comes across this thread might conclude that IR is some kind of a C or D grade composer - I don't want that to happen, do you ? moreover, why should I/we sound even slightly apologetic for being rational and factual ??
  
  Raj:
  So, you have decided to become large-hearted as well :-)
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ ss07.nc.us.ibm.com) on: Tue Mar 23 13:44:35 EST 1999
  
  Needless to say, I agree with Madhan !
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 13:57:54 EST 1999
  
  Srinath: Didnt you see the old responses? That will tell you how large my heart is. Why, it can hold the sky, you'll realise if you read my post in the previous page:)))
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ kcecfp01.sprint.com) on: Tue Mar 23 13:58:50 EST 1999
  
  Madhan,
  Who is this Mridangam player anyway? First of all Mridangam is a Tala Vaadhyam so it does'nt logically flow that he necessarily knows about Raagas too. In any case, if he (or you on his behalf) claims that mohanam = yaman, I suggest you take the shortest route to Madras Music Academy and submit your/his discovery to them. One of you will definitely get a doctorate out of this. Please don't be disheartened by the 'way' in which this 'Ph.D' is delivered to you (it will hurt but you will get used to it).BTW what other gems do you have for us? :)
  
  Hey, can your Mridangam friend (while he is waiting to board the train to go to Music Academy) also solve the transportation algorithm, cure for HIV, UFO, life in outer space and other such petty problems. Please share the name of this friend (whose words are the gospel truth to you) so that I can enter his name in my database of musicians to avoid:)
  
  BTW my friend who is a violin player, has a cousin who is a bass guitarist - whose neighbor's dog thinks you are full of cra* when you stubbornly defend mohanam = yaman. Sure! What does a dog know anyway? Keep smiling!!
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 14:03:44 EST 1999
  
  rajaG: Is that bass guitarist called Srinath, by any chance?:)).
  (Pochu, Indha thread-um dhjksfl aayachu!)
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ kcecfp01.sprint.com) on: Tue Mar 23 14:16:28 EST 1999
  
  Raj,
  
  Since we now have evidence that IR, ARR, Deva, MSV (in no particular order) have all copied in some shape or form, only YOU and ME stand as the people who have never copied tunes. (We have not produced any original tune either, but that is a minor issue lost in the details). So get ready!! DRUM ROLL!!!
  
  "COPY ADIKKAADHA, TEA YUM ADIKAADHA, ISAI SOORAAVALIGAL RAJ AND RAJA"
  Of course we might have competition from MMT (Madhan's Mridhanga ThOzhan)
  
  (Che! indha kadi joke enakkEy pidikkala)
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ ss07.nc.us.ibm.com) on: Tue Mar 23 14:26:57 EST 1999
  
  Raj:
  Idhula anyayam enna naa, naane violin player, naane bass guitaristum :-) Yes, it is true, I was formally tutuored in classical music on the violin for 6 gruelling years :-))) - of course, I never learnt anything is a different issue ;-) And No ! I am not RajaG's friend's cousin who's neighbour has a dog that speaks its mind to RajaG (namma Kirk Cameron maadhiri ivarum Dog Psychologist-a irupparo ? ;-))
  
  RajaG:
  Didn't it strike you as odd that someone would bring in Madhan's love for IR's music and a common browser error (double posting) as arguments against Madhan's lack of knowledge in carnatic music ? Double posting pannaravangellaam paithiyakaarangala ? illa vivaram theriyaadhavangalukku personal preferences irukka koodadha ? Yenna saar nyayam idhu ? Konjam yen threadukku (Film Music Videos...) poi yedhavadhu nalladha contribute pannungo ! Seriously man, I need some help there ! :-)
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 14:35:36 EST 1999
  
  So, if you had continued , we could have had Srinath('s) Viol(ati)n(g) music?:)).(Isnt that why you meant when you said "Anyayam ennanna Naan Violin player" ..?
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 14:38:07 EST 1999
  
  rajaG: Naan mathavanga tune-ai bathroomla paadinadukke enge neighbourhood-la 40 casualties. Innum original tune vera poda aarambicha...India-la janathogai nalla kuraiyum:))
  
  (Hmmm...not a bad idea anyway, Raja 70% recycle, 20% waste-nu sonnavangala nallaa pazhi vaangalaam:))
  
  
• From: chandy (@ 209.125.83.228) on: Tue Mar 23 14:39:58 EST 1999
  
  
  Its quite interesting to see how one's communication can get twisted, turned and misinterpreted. First of all, I would NOT like to branded as a pro or anti IR or ARR. The point I'm trying to repeatedly make is that the die-hard IR fans seem to be going overboard in their adulation for IR. Theres nothing wrong about their worship, but in this process, they seem to degrade other MDs, directors, singers and attribute everything and anything positive to IR. I pointed out that IR is no Mr.Clean IF he has lifted any songs. Though I took care to mention that "IR is no Mr.Clean IF he has lifted..", it was subequently interpreted by Raj as No clean implies bracketing IR with ARR and Deva, and Kiru went ahead to say that it is hard to digest to see people bracketing IR, ARR, and Deva together... When did I "accuse", "bracket" ??? I just tried to point out that IR need not be a Mr.Clean IF he has lifted!! And there seems to be an immediate brand on me.... and Raj wonders if i am am accusing IR of lifts because I feel IR ran out of ideas!! And.... when Mr.Kuzhapam's name is mentioned, my name also gets tagged along.... ????? Whos bracketing now?? :)) Added to this are the comments which are person-specific rather than issue-driven!
  
  Do people "Karuchukottify" IR here? Is pointing out the lifted/inspired songs (how much ever less they may be), tantamount to Karuchukotufying ?? If the die-hard fans can attributevery many successess in TF world solely to IR, whys this so-called minuscule 3/4000 fraction appear as "Karuchukotufying" to them?? In a cleaner white cloth, even a small black dot would mask the overall cleanliness of the cloth.. and this is exactly what seem to be happening to IR in this thread!! IR is a person of great stature, glory, creator etc.... but there is a black mark even on this man of such a stature. One can choose to ignore these blackmarks considering the brighter whiteness, but it cannot be denied that the black mark exists, how much ever minuscule it may be! And this black mark should atleast be kept in the mind, when someone tries to glorify the MD of his liking, esp at the cost of demeaning someone(everyone) else!
  
  chandy
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Mar 23 15:00:24 EST 1999
  
  Chandy The only places where I put your name next to Kuzhappam was in
  "In defernece to Chandy and Kuzhappam's wishes that I investigate..."
  Tell me what else could I have written. Both you and Kuzhappam independently asked me/ srinath to investigate Raja's copies. I just mentioned "I want to know from Chandy, Kuzhapam et al.."
  . Perhaps I should have said :"Chandy asked me to investigate, and also, Kuzhappam asked me to investigate" . Anyway that is what I meant. Well,let me put it this way...both of you accused Raja of copying and I wanted to know from both of you that whether you think it is because he ran dry. Perhaps I should have alllotted one sentence each for the two of you. But then , you know how difficult it is to type a lengthy post without having to insert separate sentences for each person.:))
  
  Botttomline is I never put meant to you in the same "class" as kuzhappam if that is what is bothering you:))). However, what is this thing about cleanliness. I am not harping on cleanliness. I am harping on the difference between Raja and ARR/Deva. I pointed out why I consider their copies different in nature. I pointed out that succumbing to friendship/gratitude is a human failing...a very common one at that..I am sure all of us will be guilty of that . If you aren't, I am sorry . Whereas copying for survival and shamelessly parasiting on others for survival is a shameful "inhuman" failing , worthy of a lowly creature like a parasite. Finally two questions two you:
  
  1. Do you think Raja copied because he couldnt think of his own tune?
  2. Do you or do you not mean to say Raja's copies are similar to Deva's ,ARR's copies?
  
  Okay, I'll admit Raja is unclean. So, please cut out that cleanliness stuff. Your point taken. ight HO!I am off!
  
  

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